Tamiya MFU tech question

[calm n sedated]

Does tamiya have any plans to design an MFU for the big rig series that fully works with the new futaba faast systems or the spektrum series. This technology is vastly becoming the new wave of the Rc industry and has so many advantages over the old AM, FM, PCM systems. It's just is not compatable with the MFU. The MFU is awesome on the big rigs but the hinderance is the old radios with poor resolution and glitching issues. Any info available?

[tc1cat]

I hope so!!! We definitally need some help in this direction. Is there anything being done??

[Mouton]

One a positive note, the more people that migrate to 2.4 GHz means less people on "our" frequencies!:LOL:

I must say that I have never experienced the resolution to be a problem with the MFU. If you consider the resolution to be so low that is is problematic you should perhaps check your servos? I agree that I have a higher resolution on my PCM-system with expensive digital servos that I run on my large scale gasser. But really, Not that I have driven my semi extensively, but I have driven it enough not to even think of resolution as an issue.

Glitches can be minimized by separation the MFU from the receiver and using the antenna that came with the model. Most of us skip that since it has a negative impact on the scale appearance. Poor antenna placement (close to vibration unit motor/truck motor) is one of the culprits.

There ought not to be an issue when using a 2.4 GHz regarding the resolution as older analogue servos are ok for 2.4 GHz use. Same goes for PCM. The problem with PCM can be the built in fail safe on every channel. The MFU would prefer such features to be disabled. Same goes for 2.4 GHz systems.

The real issues with any modern transmitter are the trims, that are digital today. Find a 2.4 GHz system with analogue trims and you are good to go. If there is a technological issue that can cause harm to the MFU I would really like to know about it!

Since the MFU only uses trim settings at their neutral and end points there really should not be that much of a hassle to actually use digital trims. You dont' do operations involving the trim settings that often during normal driving (i.e. motor revving/running, motor starting/stopping). That is more of a nuissance than an actual preventing factor.

Part of me believes that the "problems" when using anything else than a AM/FM PPM transmitter are of the same nature as the warning not to use anything else than the stock motor in the High-Lift (and that without even mentioning the MFU as the limiting factor)...

I believe the reason is that Tamiya simply did not test it (2.4 GHz was not on the market) when they designed the MFU. When the did the MFU for the High-Lift the simply based it on the one for the semis.

Another thing to keep in mind is that 2.4 GHz is not big in Japan. Only Futaba has it. JR does not, neither does Sanwa (Airtronics to you Americans). Why, you ask, well 2.4 GHz is not allowed for RC in Japan. Why that is I do not know. However, since it is not allowed Tamiya most probably see no reason for testing with it.

[tc1cat]

Makes sense if they don't do anything about the digital trim radios and the MFUs. Problem though is that almost all of the US radio companies are going digital trims now. I tried a Spektrum DX6 with a Tamiya Mammoth Dump Truck and it would not work with it either but the Spektrums work with the 1/16th scale tanks which have a digital speed control as well as a MFU to control them. Makes no sense why the digital trims work with some MFUs and not others.

[Gomjaba]

This is really becoming a problem. It is SO hard to get a radio working with the MFU its beyond believe.

Most people (especially in Europe) have to go through eBay. I don't know how to solve issues like that - but I am not a developer :) Just a frustrated user hunting for a 6 channel Futaba (40Mhz) for almost 6 month now ..

[Mouton]

Do you live in Europe?

I know that the British distributor RipMaz (http://www.ripmax.com) carries the Futaba Skysport 4 ch on FM 40 MHz. They even stock the discontinued Field Force 6 ch on FM 40 MHz. They both have analogue trims and will work with the MFU.

Same in Germany where Robbe (http://www.robbe.de) has the Robbe/Futaba F-14 on both FM 40 and 41 MHz.

The Swedish case is similar. The Swedish Futaba distributor carries the Skysport 4 on MF 40 MHz and the Tamiya distributor, Eber Toys AB (http://www.ebertoysab.se) carries another compatible transmitter for its customers (a Sanwa if memory serves me right).

So, it really is not that difficult for us European to find alternatives to the Futaba 4VWD if we do not wish to order from outside the EU.

On a 2.4 GHz note, I would like to add that since my previous post both Sanwa/Airtronics and KO Propo have presented 2.4 GHz systems, however none with analogue trims.

[Gomjaba]

Do you live in Europe?

I know that the British distributor RipMaz (http://www.ripmax.com) carries the Futaba Skysport 4 ch on FM 40 MHz. They even stock the discontinued Field Force 6 ch on FM 40 MHz. They both have analogue trims and will work with the MFU.

Same in Germany where Robbe (http://www.robbe.de) has the Robbe/Futaba F-14 on both FM 40 and 41 MHz.

The Swedish case is similar. The Swedish Futaba distributor carries the Skysport 4 on MF 40 MHz and the Tamiya distributor, Eber Toys AB (http://www.ebertoysab.se) carries another compatible transmitter for its customers (a Sanwa if memory serves me right).

So, it really is not that difficult for us European to find alternatives to the Futaba 4VWD if we do not wish to order from outside the EU.

On a 2.4 GHz note, I would like to add that since my previous post both Sanwa/Airtronics and KO Propo have presented 2.4 GHz systems, however none with analogue trims.

:yourock:

Not cheap - but an option .. You say it is not THAT hard .. if you are a beginner like I am .. it is .. This is no rant, but it took 6 !! month until I have received an email from TamiyaUSA that I should check the website for compatible radios ... as if ... Tamiya Germany : They don't know, I should ask in forums and Tamiya JP refered me to Tower or similar as they should know .. As I said .. I don't want to hijack this thread to rant, even tho I did that in the past .. this is rather to show you that it is NOT easy for a beginner to get a straight answer .. ****, I didn't even know what analogue trim is.

Ideal would be

1. Tamiya offeres to sell compatible radios in their shop
2. Tamiya offers a compatibility list
3. Tamiya creates and MFU which works with the up2date radios

Hidden door 4 is .. don't use an MFU if you intend to use a recent radio.

BUT : THANK you very much for the links .. Seeing now even an 8-channel radio with multi functions (up to 160) gives me so many possibilities so that I can scratch now my "workaroud" to use a 2nd remote and get going with my initial project .. :P

[JasonInAugusta]

I've been using my Spektrum DX6 on my MFU in the Hi-lift Hilux with no issues.

I can activate turn signals and such just fine, turn lights on/off, operate the horn...and I don't have to touch the trims.

[epoxydude]

Ive seen no mention to Hitec radio's i have a laser 6 from them and have been told it works . well i hope if anyone knows different then let me know ..

[Mouton]

As long as you have analogue trims you ought to be fine.

Few Japanese manufacturers mention Hitec in their documentation as Hitec is Korean. Most Japanese RC-car makers have longstanding relationships with one or more of the Japanese RC-manufacturers.

[Larrio]

Now some of you might think i'm biased in this statement, however....

Would it be possible (and easier) for the 2.4ghz manufacturers to create software to work with the multi function units? Updating software is a lot easier than creating new hardware (since all the old versions will be rendered useless). I.E. - 2.4 ghz systems come with a "MFU setting".

Now i'm not a radio expert. I just know the our semi, trucks, and tanks don't work with digital trim radios. I'm not exactlyl clear on the exact technical reasoning for that.

[Gomjaba]

Now some of you might think i'm biased in this statement, however....

Would it be possible (and easier) for the 2.4ghz manufacturers to create software to work with the multi function units? Updating software is a lot easier than creating new hardware (since all the old versions will be rendered useless). I.E. - 2.4 ghz systems come with a "MFU setting".

Now i'm not a radio expert. I just know the our semi, trucks, and tanks don't work with digital trim radios. I'm not exactlyl clear on the exact technical reasoning for that.

I don't know why it doesn't work either, maybe someone from Tamiya can shed some light on it WHY it requires analogue trim.

[Larrio]

Tech says he doesn't know either. The theory is that the radio may be confused since there is no physical endpoint on the digital trim. We had one customer that got his to work on digital trim but it took a long time and it was quite a hassle.

We worked with Spectrum regarding the matter at a trade show once. They were stumped also and said, "we'll get back to you" (I think this was a few years ago).

[tc1cat]

Larrio,
The Spektrums work with the tank's MFU as many of the tankers are goin to them to allow more tanks on the battlefield at one time. I am at a loss as you are as to why the 2.4 radios work with some MFUs and not all.

tc1cat

[Lunchboxer]

So there's no way to get the MFU to work w/ TX w/ digital trims?

Or it is just inconvenient? i.e., you have to push the button on the digital trim to up and down a certain level, compare to just sliding the analog trim to the stop?

I am currently using a 4EXA (75MHz ground frequency) and it works fine.. but just prefer the 6EXA 2.4GHz if possible..

Thoughts?

[Gomjaba]

I / We wish we would have a def. answer ... But only my next rig has MFU (ordered) and a 6 channel is simply too expensive to try ...not to mention a receiver etc.

[Lunchboxer]

I guess maybe I will try it out for you guys then.. ha! I was told that the it works okay w/ the tank's DMD.. (I have a Leo 2 A6, but hasn't built it up yet)

I will see if it works w/ the semi MFU.. I have that in my Aeromax, which is currently running Futaba 4EXA.. (75MHz surface frequency model) w/ analog trims.. I can test it out when I got time, I guess..

Also got a MFU for the F-350.. that's why I was hoping that maybe I can just use the 2.4GHz radio for all.. instead of the 4EXA..

[Gomjaba]

Well apparently it does work for the tank .. that is the weird thing .. and apparently even the tech guy from Tamiya USA has no idea why it doesn't work (posted here somewhere).

I found another solution for me at least .. The reason I wanted a >4 channel radio was that I am building some additional electric which I want to be able to contraol remotely ..

Then I figuered that all I need is on/off ... so ... the 4YF has a trainer switch which I don't need .. AND enough space inside of the handset .. I bought on eBay a small RF transmitter / receiver which is used ie for garage doors ..

Size of a match box... Circuit board out of the hand remote .. push button connected to trainer switch .. hooked up to the battery .. done :P

And the electric I mounted on the trailer has an external 12V battery pack anyway ... enough oompf for the receiver ..

http://images.virtualvillage.com/003601-016/001.jpg 2 channel version though but you can see how small that is

[Gomjaba]

Hey just wanted to say I use a Spetkrum DX6 park flyer on all my rigs and work great with all the trim settings that it has. And I even use it in my Tamiya Knight Hauler with the mulit-function contol unit. ;D

I was taking now his word for it

http://i31.tinypic.com/dx029c.jpg

So I HOPE this was a good investment :P

[spankrjs]

Is it even necessary to move the trim levers to get the functions to work? The instructions say you have to move them, but it has been my experience that you don't. I know on my King Tiger I never have to touch the trims to get the guns to fire. I just move the stick very rapidly and the gun will fire. I use a FM Skysport on ground frequency with the little lever trim tabs. Do the truck MFU's have that many more functions that you have to move more then one trim at a time to get one function to work?

[Gomjaba]

Truck MFU have quite a few functions .. but when I browse through the manual I cannot see why it shouldn't work.
I guess if you can move the stick just a TINY bit in a specific speed - it should work too .. but I am far from working with the MFU just yet .. still modifiying / building ...